Bring back !tank?

[nameismud]

!tank got removed awhile back with a post like this. The aim was to make ren more vanilla. Some people in the server today were suggesting we bring it back. Air/Wf were dead on deth_river. Thoughts?

[InspectorGadget]

my first thought is na, i didn´t like it when it was active. air + wf dead is annoying, but we´ve got other options. make buildings unrepairable or just skip directly to another map.

[nameismud]

4 minutes ago, InspectorGadget said:

my first thought is na, i didn´t like it when it was active. air + wf dead is annoying, but we´ve got other options. make buildings unrepairable or just skip directly to another map.

Polls in game rarely work is the only problem with that.

[Kingoberv]

Do remotes spawn in weapons and are engineers able to pick them up outside of the demolition crate?

I have not noticed this spawn here at rencorner. It's possible i have just missed it. But this i feel personally is a better way at being able to balance a wf/strip dead. Especially if refinery goes. Engineer level able to take a building with remote spawn.

[Goztow]

Please no. Commands like these just drag out most games more rather than finish them faster. Cause killing a building does not punish the enemy as much as it should. It also makes the refinery the super duper important building to defend cause wf and air can be partially 'replaced' with a great money flow. 

There is an easy solution to games getting dragged out too long if both loose wf /air. It's called a time limit. Westwood had understood that very correctly. 

Suggestion : whenever both air and wf die a time-limit of 30 minutes starts. 

[Manuel857]

No.

Games will drag on forever with it enabled.

[nameismud]

3 hours ago, Goztow said:

Please no. Commands like these just drag out most games more rather than finish them faster. Cause killing a building does not punish the enemy as much as it should. It also makes the refinery the super duper important building to defend cause wf and air can be partially 'replaced' with a great money flow. 

There is an easy solution to games getting dragged out too long if both loose wf /air. It's called a time limit. Westwood had understood that very correctly. 

Suggestion : whenever both air and wf die a time-limit of 30 minutes starts. 

Yes we can set times. Issue with that is some people I guess like these style of games. So anytime in the past when I’ve asked if everyone wants a time limit it’s difficult to get a response.

[InspectorGadget]

yeah asking for something is even a worse nightmare than getting through a vote. i kinda think we also don´t need a rule for these things that is set in stone. higher up mods should just decide on ocasion what´s the best thing in the current situation. if the server is dying cause of a stalemate game that everyone has lost the will to play then do a timelimit/make buildings unrepairable, whatever. if the server fills up and people are still having fun let it play out.

 

bringing back !tank might be a nice tool for certain situations but it completely ruins others, it does more damage than it does good imo.

 

 

[ILL]

remove marathon, make all maps 60 min MAX, or base destruction

[nameismud]

58 minutes ago, InspectorGadget said:

yeah asking for something is even a worse nightmare than getting through a vote. i kinda think we also don´t need a rule for these things that is set in stone. higher up mods should just decide on ocasion what´s the best thing in the current situation. if the server is dying cause of a stalemate game that everyone has lost the will to play then do a timelimit/make buildings unrepairable, whatever. if the server fills up and people are still having fun let it play out.

 

bringing back !tank might be a nice tool for certain situations but it completely ruins others, it does more damage than it does good imo.

 

 

I made the post about removing it too lol. It’s been so long I’ve forgotten the main reason for it, other than a more classic ren. But yesterday deth river was one of those matches. Nobody was trying just sniping in tuns. I like marathon at times, but not when it turns into almost unwinninable situations without strong teamwork which is nonexistent most of the time anyway, or a lucky very limited crate spawn. Something needs to change about it for sure.

[Kingoberv]

4 hours ago, nameismud said:

Yes we can set times. Issue with that is some people I guess like these style of games. So anytime in the past when I’ve asked if everyone wants a time limit it’s difficult to get a response.

That's me. I'm a die hard marathon fan. My favorite games are bar+agt versus Hon+okby. Especially on something like field. It actually eventually forces some of the best teamwork you'll ever see in a public server once everyone gets their fill of kill whoring. There is that shining glimpse of something special that ends those ones.

Edited July 16, 2023 by Kingoberv

[XtremePro]

2 hours ago, InspectorGadget said:

yeah asking for something is even a worse nightmare than getting through a vote. i kinda think we also don´t need a rule for these things that is set in stone. higher up mods should just decide on ocasion what´s the best thing in the current situation. if the server is dying cause of a stalemate game that everyone has lost the will to play then do a timelimit/make buildings unrepairable, whatever. if the server fills up and people are still having fun let it play out.

 

bringing back !tank might be a nice tool for certain situations but it completely ruins others, it does more damage than it does good imo.

 

 

Exactly.  I'm a big proponent of knowing your audience.  Each one is different and unique in it's own way.  

[nameismud]

3 minutes ago, Kingoberv said:

That's me. I'm a die hard marathon fan. My favorite games are bar+agt versus Hon+okby. Especially on something like field. It actually eventually forces some of the best teamwork you'll ever see in a public server once everyone gets their fill of kill whoring. There is that shining glimpse of something special that ends those ones.

Ya I knew we had some players that like this kind of play. After a certain point for me it just gets really boring waiting on ppl to play as a team. I’m not sure how on deth river you could win a match like that without crates, and they don’t spawn frequently enough and are so random. 

[Kingoberv]

Just now, nameismud said:

Ya I knew we had some players that like this kind of play. After a certain point for me it just gets really boring waiting on ppl to play as a team. I’m not sure how on deth river you could win a match like that without crates, and they don’t spawn frequently enough and are so random. 

Death river is kind of unique in that regard. That Damm near is a stalemate map if the wrong series of buildings die. You can get a few buildings with infantry. But the distance between agt/obby and the entrances are too far to sneak through to others even if you had 25 players gathered together and moved as a unit you would still never get one inside. Honestly on that map, i think that is the most obvious map where intervention would probably be accepted by all. Even die hards like myself. Your completely at the whim of a spy crate or saving up vehicles. And it's such a large map, it's not even really that fun for kill whoring. 

[MarcPoulet]

Nahh we won with a bunch of gunners & teamwork. Yay! 

[Kingoberv]

21 minutes ago, MarcPoulet said:

Nahh we won with a bunch of gunners & teamwork. Yay! 

Take bar away from gdi on that map and have fun rushing obby with naiders lol.

[WNxDestr0y3r]

id say yes but have the !tank command re-done. when the WF/air dies then the !tank command  enables but each player is limited to the amount of tanks they can purchase a game when either building dies etc. would make them purchases more meaningful and useful imo. say 5-7 tanks per person after WF dies each map  and it's only enabled during marathon games.

[gypsies]

It could make sense to add it back in but make it grotesquely expensive like 10k/tank. I always felt when you lose wf/strip, you don't really deserve to just buy a tank so easily. !tank in a way rewards the team for being sloppy and losing tank production, but just being able to do it anyway. If it carried a very hefty price tag, a team would have to pool money and make it count probably leading to sharper team play in those end games. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by gypsies

[GetPastMe]

I hated it when we removed the !tank command, but now I much prefer it is gone.

You don't want to lose wf/air??  Then start defending them!  How many times are buildings lost to lack of reps?  Lots!

As for long running games in general, TEAMWORK is the answer.  In the last couple of weeks I have played games where just having 3-4 players work together won games. 

For Deth River that is harder to do, almost impossible.  But I would rather handle it by having more spy crates if BOTH wf/air are destroyed than bring back the !tank command.

 

[Itai795]

21 hours ago, GetPastMe said:

But I would rather handle it by having more spy crates if BOTH wf/air are destroyed than bring back the !tank command.

 

that's a nice idea (I'm not sure if it can be implemented)

[C123]

Agreed with others that a time limit solves this and many other problems.

But if we aren't going to address that, another solution could be to disable the agt/ob if both wf/air have been destroyed. It solves the no vehicle problem and could make for a fun change of pace on some maps. 

Maybe it would need to happen only if both agt/ob were still alive, so that in cases where one team has already destroyed agt/ob, they get to keep their advantage.